The PodKnowledge|← All Episodes
Based on Lenny's Podcast data
Lenny's Knowledge Sketch

How to Level Up as a PM:
Skills, Mentors & Learning Loops

Jules Walter
Product Leader, YouTube (Google)
Podcast Guest
The Framework

Two Skill Buckets
for PM Growth

IQ SKILLS(Hard Skills)EQ SKILLS(Soft Skills)EarlyCareerLaterCareer
  • IQ skills first: execution, product sense, strategy
  • EQ skills later: communication, leadership, feedback
  • Learn one skill at a time, don't try to master everything
  • Progress compounds when you pick the right sequence
The progressionEarly-career PMs should obsess over execution and strategy. EQ becomes critical as you lead teams and influence orgs.
The Mechanism

The Forcing Function:
Learn by Building

  • Create a goal. Decide what you want to learn (activation, monetization, strategy, growth org design)
  • Pick a real problem. Your ass is on the line, this forces real learning
  • Find mentors. Work backwards from people who know the thing you're learning
  • Close the loop. Come back and report results, get next pointers, iterate
1
mentor who knows
∞
times you loop
6
months to move needle
"I want to go back to the mentor and say, 'Hey, I did this. It was successful. Thanks a lot. Now I'm thinking about this other problem.' I keep going and that's how I rinse and repeat, and over time I drive the outcome and I also know I'm getting better."
IQ Mastery

How to Learn Execution,
Strategy & Product Sense

  • Execution: Attend amazing PMs' meetings. Watch how they move things forward, what they say, what they don't.
  • Strategy: Find people who've done great strategy. Get their artifacts (memos, decks). Reverse-engineer the questions they answered.
  • Product Sense: Identify correlations with success. Talk to researchers, data analysts. Build hypothesis then test.
Collect the docs

Save great emails, strategy memos, exec updates. Build a personal library of templates. Study what makes each one work.

See the backstage

Ask to watch strategy get built. See the iteration, the feedback loops, the thought process, not just the final artifact.

Interview Playbook

Getting Into
Great Companies

  • Do dozens of mock interviews, not zero. Most people read about it instead of practicing.
  • Deliberate practice: interview with people who are actually good at it
  • You will get rejected at first. Even great PMs interview at Google 10+ times before getting in
  • No company gives feedback after interviews, so self-awareness is your only tool
The hidden barrierGetting into a world-class company dramatically changes trajectory. But getting in requires skill you don't learn elsewhere. This is a barrier especially for underrepresented folks.
Unconventional

What PM Learning Myths Miss

✗You learn from seeing final productsINSTEAD →✓ You learn from seeing iteration, backstage feedback, and the versions that failed.
✗Great mentors won't help youINSTEAD →✓ People are flattered. No one asks. "I read your doc. Tell me about it?" is enough.
✗Interview skills don't matter for PM hiringINSTEAD →✓ Interviewing is a learnable skill. It's the gate to the companies that will accelerate your growth.
✗You learn by studying aloneINSTEAD →✓ You learn by building real stuff, with mentors, in companies where great examples surround you.
Based on Jules Walter's episode on Lenny's Podcast. All ideas on this page are from the episode.Watch on YouTubeFollow @julesdwalt on X
GO DEEPER IN THE EPISODE
06:07 Two paths to becoming a product manager07:20 How Jules became the first growth PM at Slack09:03 Black Product Managers Network and Codepath.org12:05 The most important skills to refine as a PM: IQ skills and EQ skills14:48 How to improve your interview skills18:50 Why interviewing is more difficult for underrepresented people20:39 EQ skills: what are they and how to improve them22:44 The EQ skills Jules has had to develop over the course of his career24:27 The importance of having a mentor or coach for self-reflection26:09 How cultivating self-awareness helped Jules improve his communication30:13 Strategies for learning new skills35:32 Improving strategy, execution, and product sense37:00 How identifying best practices can help you improve skills40:22 Communicating clearly and asking for feedback42:38 Methods Jules uses to improve skills45:31 How to approach asking for feedback47:46 Why it’s harder to get honest feedback on EQ skills50:56 The importance of understanding your strengths and weaknesses and leaning into the former55:18 Jules’s most impactful mentors56:14 The qualities to look for in a good mentor and how to approach them1:02:15 How to foster the best relationship with your mentor1:06:51 Lightning round
Every sketch here began as a transcript.

Send us yours and we’ll draw it. $1 a transcript.

Sketch mine →
𝕏︎ X / Twitterin LinkedIn📸 Instagram🔗 Copy link
0:00